It's always fun blowing things out of proportion.

But in short, a few things;
I don't believe the sole reason for there being no WPvP in WoW is that there's no incentive to do so. (The fact that there's greater rewards for lolqueue for RBG bro does factor in, I guess.)

One of the the reasons I feel there's less WPvP in WoW now is because the game has largely become 'teleport to instance from Org/Stormwind'craft.

I'm fairly confident that this is a reason, because I've played through the transitition. And the only WPvP I've had in awhile is waiting outside the Firelands Raid sniping alliance players or fighting over the summoning stone.



Because if it's Red it's Dead. No exception*. That's the conditioning of a PVP server; be it my level 15 goblin rogue or my level 85 blood elf warlock.

And shit, I've had level 20s take shots at my level 85. I'm not sure what the five of them were thinking, maybe they felt the same as me and hoped they could beat me down with numbers, but I applauded them as my Felguard cut them down.



Who said anything about a keep outside? When I said 'those guys I now in the open world' I meant generally questing together, or pillaging, or whatever.

The pair of eldar being just guys questing in the area who now have the option to kill some chaos sons of bitches.




I wouldn't say it's obsolete, I'd just say I don't like it, and prefer meeting the enemy out in the open where anyone can happen across the fighting and join in/get dragged into the fight if so they wish, in a World where there is only War, I'd prefer to quest with a need to look over my shoulder. That's my preference.

But is WPvP going to harm/distract Instanced PvP as much as Instanced PvP harms WPvP?
I don't see that myself.

There aren't any bonuses worth keeping now? Later on you say people get a 10% HP bonus, which people will feel obligated to keep.



Generally if a raid wasn't happening, a guild member would text me.



I like that you called it a chore. I knew I'd get through to you eventually.



I did come up with a solution to all the issues. Damn, you expect me to fix a system with so many problems? I'm not made of time!



People will feel like they have to do it, which is enough to make it lame.



Hats don't negatively impact an entire play style.



I'm shooting your idea down because it has viable alternatives that support or at least do not detract from other play styles.



Docking your ship makes it invincible. No defense needed, but you still have incentive to get it out there. Easy as that, you have players fighting but no schedule needed. Check out Malefactour's post in the instanced PvP forum for an example of how it would work.



You misunderstand; developers rarely put in "upkeep" or "job" type tasks. Anything where you lose something by not playing is bad, even in the minds of the developers. They care about the subscription, not whether you play.



I'd like to see sources for your proven fact. It'd be an interesting study to read, because I imagine there would be consequences other than "doing without" in a study such as that, and in that case they aren't potential gains.

Upkeep is worse in that it doesn't cause people to want to play, it causes them to feel like they're forced to play. One is good, while the other is not.



Alright, so I thought long and hard about the solutions to all the issues you brought up. I've formatted it for easy reading and shall present them to you in list form now:


Oh, I guess you didn't bring up any issues.

I really didn't have the patience to read through all the opposition, gratuitous quotations, and plain "I'm right because what I want is everything" comments. But some things to consider.

When making decisions concerning any MMO and catering we have to observe some things.

Player types is key to making a big game... if you want to attract ALL the players you have to have it all. Some people think PVE is where the money is. Other argue that PVP keeps players with longevity. The largest game populations are PVE players... but that doesn't say a whole lot about game longevity because in order to keep PvE players happy you have to introduce new content continually. I don't think Vigil is up to the task of creating expansions every 3 months to keep PVE players happy.

What keeps PVE players being PVE players? Patience. PVE players like assembly line playstyle. They like to learn what works to get the raid done or what works to optimally farm or any other PVE repetitous activity. They may argue to the contrary but the fact is, the reason most dont PvP is because they lack the patience to learn how to be flexible and continually change tactics for different situations. PVP players like to "faceroll" people and thus dedicate their time and patience to getting their ass kicked over and over until they get it down. PVE players get raged before they get it down and then throw the "PVP sucks" towel in because they can't accept that they might need more time to learn or perhaps the other guy just has more aptitude for it and they might wanna bring some more buddies.

So, we have to formulate a way to make PvP dynamic enough to satisfy PVE players with enough excitment and enough newness to where veteran PvP players do not have the edge. I think they have it right with action based play and I think as long as they prevent macros and 3rd party programs we'll see alot more interest from PvE players. Primarily because in an action based game with decent AI. There's not a whole lot of difference in fighting style in PVE vs PVP. And, I think PVE players are gonna have a blast operating vehicles. I can see PvE players manning earth shakers and basilisks, laughing as bodies are being throwing around. I see the more PvP centric players sneaking up on vehicles with melta charges and sniping people.

OW PvP will always be active as long as they properly tie in worthwhile objectives that affect both PvP and PvE play. PvE players will get involved if their favorite raid is affected or not even accessible unless domination is achieved in a sector. Also, there's always a healthy society of gankers. The stealther society will always have it's place in scouting and ambushing so there's plenty of hunting opportunity.

That being said. I still think there's room for both claimable guild bases in OW PvP and instanced guild HQ's that can't be attacked.

Ok i didn't read all of the posts i just read like the first two pages but im with gosh on the fact that having space battles would be awsome. Plus if your guild base was a battle barge than you could bring it with you to fights not just leave it at home while your getting pumbled by some one else's defences. also they could go all star wars battle front two on this game and have you and your guild members be able to invade your enimies ship and either take it over or destroy it from the inside.

Also cruseing around the sargos sectore in a craft world/battle barge/space hulk with rockets/chaos battle barge would be amazing!